Harry Willis greater than Dempsey?

[Greatest1942]

Willis beat Sam Langford, Joe Jeanette, Sam McVey. Beat Firpo easily who Dempsey had a scare with. Beat Fred Fulton, Gun Boat Smith (same as Dempsey). Beat Willie Mehan, whom Dempsey struggled with. He defeated Kid Norfolk too, a good fighter.

Arguably he was ducked by Dempsey for a astonishingly long period.

His resume of win is arguably superior to Dempsey. And he fought almost everybody there was to fight, which Dempsey didnot.

I am not saying I am confident Willis would have beat Dempsey, but the fight should have been on. And as par resume he did a better job of cleaing the division than Dempsey did IMO.

Dempsey was a iconic figure, and a much more infuential boxer....BUt it seems to me a case can be made that Willis dominated his era more than Jack Dempsey did.

[jrosales13]

Wills also destroyed Charley Weinert in 2 rounds, If I'm not mistaken even knocked him out of the ring, who was a top 5 HW at the time.

I think a case can be made that Wills should be rank higher than Dempsey. You obviously made a great case.

[JAB5239]

Dempsey while still in the 12th spot of my alltime list has potential to fall even further. Once you get past the icon status his resume sports a lot of holes. Im not saying he wasn't a great fighter because he was, but many questions have yet to be answered about his career.

[Barn]

He also made a ridiculous 32 defences of his coloured title over 3 reigns. One which spanned 8 years. This is the list I posted in the Heavyweight thread recently.

1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Larry Holmes
4. George Foreman
5. Lennox Lewis
6. Rocky Marciano
7. Sonny Liston
8. Joe Frazier
9. Jack Johnson
10. Harry Wills

[StarshipTrooper]

He also made a ridiculous 32 defences of his coloured title over 3 reigns. One which spanned 8 years. This is the list I posted in the Heavyweight thread recently.

1. Muhammad Ali
2. Joe Louis
3. Larry Holmes
4. George Foreman
5. Lennox Lewis
6. Rocky Marciano
7. Sonny Liston
8. Joe Frazier
9. Jack Johnson
10. Harry Wills

I got Harry at #12.....right after Frazier and just ahead of Lennox and Walcott.

Poet

[Barn]

I got Harry at #12.....right after Frazier and just ahead of Lennox and Walcott.

Poet

His record against Langford is something else. 16-2 or something. Whereas Langford was consistently splitting series/drawing with Jeanette and McVea at the time.

[StarshipTrooper]

His record against Langford is something else. 16-2 or something. Whereas Langford was consistently splitting series/drawing with Jeanette and McVea at the time.

Langford was clearly past it for the majority of those fights though.

Poet

[Barn]

Langford was clearly past it for the majority of those fights though.

Poet

Yeah I know but, Langford was still splitting huge series with great fighters like Jeanette and McVea when he was getting beat by Wills.

[IronDanHamza]

He's been creeping up my list recently.

[Greatest1942]

Yeah I know but, Langford was still splitting huge series with great fighters like Jeanette and McVea when he was getting beat by Wills.

In their prime I think they were locked at 2-2...Then Sam started going blind and Harry matured...the fights also became one sided.

What draws me to Willis is the fact that no one probably was ducked for a longer period of time. I think if he got the chance to fight for the title and beat Dempsey, he might be top 10...he is top 20 anyways (was #16 in Rings list of top heavyweights if I remember correctly).

I have heard compelling cases made for Dempsey being hurt for ducking Willis...but I do believe the opposite is true too. Willis if he got a chance to fight and maybe beat Dempsey, would be rated top 10 now.