Tiger Flowers.Just How Good Was he?

[Ivich]

- - How'd he let mostly blind Sam Langford near the end of his career ice him cold?

As I said his chin was not of the best. I've asked for opinions of him, I haven't given mine.I haven't made my mind up about him and thought the few sensible posters here might help me do so.

[Ivich]

Consistently ranked at or near the 10 top Middleweights in history. Speed, good power, great results, fair chin....but while he may have had Harry Greb's number, he never should have used his dentist! The *****cat of the Prize Ring and A Tiger rose out of Georgia are both recommended reading.

According to his biographer Henry Grady Edney 1928 Flowers was operated on for a sinus growth above his right eye, he collapsed and died after the operation.

[QueensburyRules]

As I said his chin was not of the best. I've asked for opinions of him, I haven't given mine.I haven't made my mind up about him and thought the few sensible posters here might help me do so.

- - IBRO

IBRO All-Time Ratings September 30, 2019 Middleweight Ratings 1. Harry Greb (609) 2. Ray Robinson (575) 3. Carlos Monzon (527) 4. Marvin Hagler (493) 5. Mickey Walker (448) 6. Stanley Ketchel (446) 7. Bob Fitzsimmons (377) 8. Bernard Hopkins (256) 9. Charley Burley (251) 10. Marcel Cerdan (248) 11. Jake LaMotta (223) 12. Tony Zale (206) 13. Tiger Flowers (202) 14. Sam Langford (195) 15. Roy Jones Jr. (170) 16. **** Tiger (168) 17. Ezzard Charles (148) 18. Mike Gibbons (137) 19. Freddie Steele (131) 20. Tommy Ryan (108)

Top Vote Getters (50 or more points): Emile Griffith (86), Ray Leonard (81), Gene Fullmer (65), Kid McCoy (64), James Toney (50).

Summary:  Greb has perhaps the greatest record of opponents in ring history, therefore it is no surprise he scored over 600 points in taking first place just as he did about 15 years ago. 20 voters had Greb in the top spot. 31 of 32 had him in the top 5.  A relatively close 2nd is the Sugar Man Ray Robinson with 575 points. He received 4 1st place votes, 11 2nd place votes, only 3 of 32 did not have Robinson in the top 5. Every voter had Robinson in the top 10 at 160 pounds.

[Ivich]

Consistently ranked at or near the 10 top Middleweights in history. Speed, good power, great results, fair chin....but while he may have had Harry Greb's number, he never should have used his dentist! The *****cat of the Prize Ring and A Tiger rose out of Georgia are both recommended reading.

Does Flowers get a lot of his status from his two hotly disputed wins over Greb ,who was surely slowing up a bit by then?
Many thought Flowers lost both those fights.

[markusmod]

- - IBRO

IBRO All-Time Ratings September 30, 2019 Middleweight Ratings 1. Harry Greb (609) 2. Ray Robinson (575) 3. Carlos Monzon (527) 4. Marvin Hagler (493) 5. Mickey Walker (448) 6. Stanley Ketchel (446) 7. Bob Fitzsimmons (377) 8. Bernard Hopkins (256) 9. Charley Burley (251) 10. Marcel Cerdan (248) 11. Jake LaMotta (223) 12. Tony Zale (206) 13. Tiger Flowers (202) 14. Sam Langford (195) 15. Roy Jones Jr. (170) 16. **** Tiger (168) 17. Ezzard Charles (148) 18. Mike Gibbons (137) 19. Freddie Steele (131) 20. Tommy Ryan (108)

Top Vote Getters (50 or more points): Emile Griffith (86), Ray Leonard (81), Gene Fullmer (65), Kid McCoy (64), James Toney (50).

Summary:  Greb has perhaps the greatest record of opponents in ring history, therefore it is no surprise he scored over 600 points in taking first place just as he did about 15 years ago. 20 voters had Greb in the top spot. 31 of 32 had him in the top 5.  A relatively close 2nd is the Sugar Man Ray Robinson with 575 points. He received 4 1st place votes, 11 2nd place votes, only 3 of 32 did not have Robinson in the top 5. Every voter had Robinson in the top 10 at 160 pounds.

Those IBRO guys are some of the craziest people out there. Had no idea they were still around.

[Ivich]

Those IBRO guys are some of the craziest people out there. Had no idea they were still around.

I believe a few dollars qualifies you as member? What gravitas can you give such an organization?

[QueensburyRules]

Those IBRO guys are some of the craziest people out there. Had no idea they were still around.

- - Someone has to do historical rankings that includes research. It's quite a thankless job.

It's not like Ring being supported by Oscar and MTK $$$.

[markusmod]

I believe a few dolloars qualifies you as member? What gravitas can you give such an organization?

Those guys in there, many of them have no lives. I've seen them bash the hell out of people over the smallest historical mistake. I think have nothing in their lives outside of that IBRO organization.

[QueensburyRules]

Those guys in there, many of them have no lives. I've seen them bash the hell out of people over the smallest historical mistake. I think have nothing in their lives outside of that IBRO organization.

- - Cliff Rold of BS generously posted his epic Ring top fighter study here to tepid reviews by this bunch.

When I rejoined the site, Henry Hascup who has to be The Savant among lesser boxing savants briefly returned as the most congenial chap on the internet.

John Sheppard the founder of Boxing's official records at BoxRec seldom posts thre save for administrative duties. Some of the guys founding Cyber Boxing who gave us early records post there as editors on occasion.

Gotta forum link where U IBRO boys post?

Chris Smith author of epic Eder Jofre autobio a pert fair nice guy, but the other Smith, Kevin I think, he could never reconcile that Dempsey never ducked Jeannette in the Milk Fund Exhibition where the promoters pulled a bait and switch that Kearns went ballistic over.

[markusmod]

- - Cliff Rold of BS generously posted his epic Ring top fighter study here to tepid reviews by this bunch.

When I rejoined the site, Henry Hascup who has to be The Savant among lesser boxing savants briefly returned as the most congenial chap on the internet.

John Sheppard the founder of Boxing's official records at BoxRec seldom posts thre save for administrative duties. Some of the guys founding Cyber Boxing who gave us early records post there as editors on occasion.

Gotta forum link where U IBRO boys post?

Chris Smith author of epic Eder Jofre autobio a pert fair nice guy, but the other Smith, Kevin I think, he could never reconcile that Dempsey never ducked Jeannette in the Milk Fund Exhibition where the promoters pulled a bait and switch that Kearns went ballistic over.

Sheppard is all about the money these days